🧿📸 In this captivating episode of the Expat Experts Podcast, we sit down with Jean Witt, a German entrepreneur who has made Athens his home. Jean shares his inspiring journey of relocating to Greece, the cultural adjustments he faced, and how these experiences shaped his entrepreneurial spirit. As the founder of Picturo.eu, Jean discusses the innovative services his company offers and how it connects people through visual storytelling. Join us to explore the intersection of culture, creativity, and business in an expat’s life!
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0:00
in this episode of expat experts we will talk with Jan wit the Creator and founder of piuro
0:07
doeu a platform where you can book photographers when you are traveling or you're local here in Greece for now but
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expanding over Europe in the next years Jan has been living in Athens for more
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than six years right now and he will explain his experience living here in Athens being a German
0:31
this is expat experts the podcast that dives into the fascinating lives of those who've lived and worked across
0:37
borders exploring the challenges experiences and insights they've gained along the
0:44
way as always if you want to stay tuned with the latest episodes of xat experts
0:49
hit the Subscribe button in YouTube and your favorite audio platforms and of course follow us in social media drop
0:56
some comments and give us some love the exper J
The expat: Jean Witt
1:02
uh thank you for coming uh thank you for having me it's very nice to have you as
1:08
a guest um we will talk about the pigo afterwards in the second part of the
1:13
episode but I would say that we now start a little bit about your life and and why you are here in Athens and uh
1:21
what what brought you here um so was Athens the first ever leaving abroad so
1:27
you're from Germany originally I'm originally from Germany yeah and uh for
1:33
me Athens was my choice because I'm half Greek oh okay so I didn't tell you
1:39
before um but I never used to grow up the Greek
1:45
way um my dad lives here in Athens I grew up with my mom and my stepdad in Germany okay so I followed very much the
1:54
the German Way of upbringing and I've been here before like 25 times for
2:00
vacation visit my dad you know spending some time here usually we have been in
2:07
either in Aus demitrios or down lagoni MH during the summertime we mostly spend
2:13
our times there know typical Greek lifestyle wake up late having a coffee
2:19
go to the beach have some food and uh you know coming back
2:24
and I was always curious to stay more and explore more more my my roots so at
2:31
some point I decided to move here and yeah for me Athens was actually the the
2:37
only choice I wanted to make for living abroad okay so you came directly from
2:43
from Germany to to Greece yeah okay when was that um it was in
2:50
2018 okay um it came very spontaneously I was at work um at my job back then in
2:57
in Germany and I was a little bit bored I have worked there for five six years in the company and you know my whole
3:04
daily routine got me a little bit bored and uh while work I Googled just for fun
3:12
like job opportunities in in Athens and I think it was through the
3:18
German Greek Embassy uh I found a position and um I just wrote an email
3:24
there just without any expectations I just wrote like one line like hey saw
3:30
your job offer is it still valid and that's it and I got the reply
3:37
quite fast like after a half an hour or so uh a girl uh replied to me that it's
3:44
still valid and she asked if I'm willing to have a quick phone call and I agreed
3:51
so I went outside we had a phone call she explained me a little bit uh what they're doing and uh stuff like this and
3:58
I think it took from them and maybe two months and I was here
4:04
everything happened very quickly very spontaneous I was not really prepared or have planned it it was just like I had
4:11
my life you know very stable with house with job with friends with everything and just because I was bored at some
4:17
point and I thought like oh it would be nice to live abroad live in Athens um I
4:23
I found this job I sent an email and two months later I was here B was a little bit of breaking their routine in there
4:29
yeah and and actually it was supposed to be only for one year okay um I also kept
4:35
my house in in Germany I rented it out with all my Furnitures and stuff um but yeah now it's six six and a half
4:44
years approximately not bad yeah that's a long time yeah well many things have
4:50
changed as I told you before um I met my wife I got two
4:56
kids yeah that's a big thing I mean come on you're coming from Germany for one year and then you met someone and you
5:02
have two Greek kids because they born here so yeah it was it was an Unexpected Journey
5:09
until here um especially from from saying okay I'm bored from my from my routine to have two kids that's a big
5:16
change yeah I just wanted to go for one year spend one summer here go to the
5:21
beach every day you know enjoy because also the town where I was from it was not very big it was I don't know 160,000
5:30
habitants um and it it gets a bit boring after quite a time it's also Germany it
5:37
has not so much this night out lifestyle like like here and uh just wanted to
5:43
come spend the year here enjoy life and then go back and have again my stable
5:50
life but uh yeah plant have changed somehow and uh
5:55
clearly it have been um yeah six six and a half crazy years I see but you knew
6:03
already like where you were coming from it's not that just I don't know for me for example I came two or three times to
6:10
Greece in general before coming to live here in my life you said that you came
6:15
like 25 times with your family that you half Greek so you knew what you were
6:21
really coming or it was still a surprise when you arrive here it was still a surprise because I I have been here a
6:26
lot before but as I said before usually I spend like a week per year either in
6:32
summer or in Autumn um most of the time somewhere in lagoni you know my dad rented their
6:39
house because I have also two brothers um who are living in Germany who from him um so it was usually kind of family
6:48
meeting out in lagoni we spent most of the time there maybe once per visit we we went to
6:55
the Center for a coffee or for little walk but it was not really that I knew
7:01
the city very well I I knew the the the coastline very well because we have been
7:06
there to a lot of different beaches and stuff but it's it's not that I have really explored the
7:13
city and what did you do when you arrive here what was the work about this uh
7:19
Embassy related or no no it was a exhibition stand builder company uh they
7:25
also based in Germany mhm and they were looking for German speaking sales managers and
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um yeah I just applied there and they like me I like them and uh I started
7:41
working their right away was good times um I used to travel then a lot because
7:46
whenever I booked a project uh usually it was somewhere in Germany because
7:52
Germany has the biggest biggest market for exhibition stand building they have
7:57
a lot of exhibitions and stuff so most of the times I traveled to Germany which
8:02
was a bit boring um but yeah also to many other places have been in in this in the
8:09
states or to some other places in Europe um yeah it was nice until covid
8:16
came that's something that I wanted to ask also because you said you said 2018 that means that you passed Co and
8:24
quarantine here in Greece yes and as far as know I mean I arrived to Greece just
8:32
after the last big quarantine but it was kind of Hardcore times as far as like
8:39
people told me here in r that it was rather strict yeah it was pretty strict it was pretty strict I even bought a
8:45
bicycle I mean Athens is not a not a bike place not a bike place so whoever comes here I don't recommend to drive a
8:52
bike no bicycle it's a and a bike I have a motorbike but don't do that either
8:58
don't do that I have a friend from Germany who got a scooter here who lives here as well and
9:05
I think after like two weeks he got crashed on the street and I warned him I said don't do it he didn't listen and
9:12
yeah but but he's he's fine especially if you drive like a German in GRE then this doesn't fit together you need to
9:19
like drive like a Greek in GRE to be able to drive anything yeah but yeah in
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general while Co it was very strict and very boring uh I used to live back then
9:30
in alimos which is not a very exciting neighborhood you know you we were just supposed to be can't remember 500 meters
9:38
around our house or something like this some somewhere close and um alimos
9:44
doesn't have a lot to offer in terms of you know drinks or food or whatsoever so
9:52
I was pretty stuck there in this neighborhood uh was was boring boring times did you met your wife before or
9:59
after before before at least that were you living together at that point of
10:05
time yes and you survived the co together so we survived together it was not so bad I
10:12
have to admit I mean we get along very good so well you could imagine that doing quarantine in alimos alone that
10:19
would have been more hardore probably yes absolutely or not depending
10:24
on the on the relationship no no it was so
10:31
maybe how did you met your wife your wife is Greek she she's Greek you made
10:37
it you made here in in um very unromantic on
10:44
Tinder what was it called I forgot no the other I don't even know if it exist
10:49
anymore Badu bad yeah yeah very unromantic don't know if it's but I met
10:55
my girlfriend through ther right so it's not it's how it goes right now modern times yes saw a statistic the other day
11:02
actually and was like nearly a nearly 60% I think people were meeting
11:08
through internet now so I think especially now if you go out
11:15
nowadays people are more shy I mean when we were young you know I think it was
11:21
more easy to speak to strangers you know in clubs or in the street or whatsoever
11:26
nowadays I I have the impression that it's not so common anymore because everything's everybody's Used to Know
11:33
use this ad this apps or Instagram or whatsoever so it's not so common anymore
11:42
to hit on on somebody on the even with that it's just like crazy I think it changed the whole perspective on how to
11:49
do things like it went from okay I meet someone in a claer in in a bar or
11:54
whatever I try to talk to them to okay I meet someone or I know someone and then
12:00
I talk to this person through Instagram so you don't even talk in person anymore you flirt through through Instagram or
12:07
whatever it's just like okay wow things have have changed in this way how old
12:13
are your kids now uh my daughter is now a bit more than 2 years and my son is now almost 5
12:22
months okay so you have a pretty recent baby newborn and the last
12:30
it's in cam right I want you to know um no joking um how was the
12:39
experience of having kids here in grece like how is it I don't know Hospital how is the
12:44
whole process of uh my wife is from Tripoli okay uh
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so let me start from the beginning like when we got pregnant the first time we went here to
12:57
the doctors you know to go for regular checks and stuff and um here usually you
13:06
have to pay you go to private doctors you have to pay um we have to find somebody who is good
13:12
and also not too expensive because we have been to some in konaki which were
13:19
supposed to be good but also very pricey it's konaki yes um but yeah this in
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general was all right no no worries about that we have been warned a lot
13:32
about um cesarians okay so we were very careful who going to choose as a final
13:39
doctor but okay again my wife is from Tripoli and they we know the doctors she
13:45
knows the doctors there from the uh hospital and so we decided when it comes
13:53
towards the end to have no difficulties not to go here somewhere in the Private
13:58
Hospital and maybe for whatever reason because we hear a lot of stories from
14:03
friends or other people that you know the doctors they tell you some stories like oh I see something I don't like we
14:10
have to make a cesarian and stuff like this so we decided to go to Tripoli to a
14:16
public Hospital mhm um I have to say uh the doctors were amazing okay um but the
14:25
hospital different no than in different than in Germany yes I think some of the
14:31
the hospital some of the jails we have in in Germany look better than this
14:37
Hospital yeah I don't know it's and from from inside was even worse let I had I
14:42
had a a knee surgery here okay this year beginning of this year
14:48
actually and I was okay I mean the hospital was
14:54
old in the sense of like building wise and that that was a little bit like the shocking part of it but in general I was
15:02
treated really well and everything went pretty good uh the doctors were nice
15:07
they were doing a good job but it's true that building infrastructure wise it was
15:13
like okay wow okay where I'm entering no and yes now that I go to the Physio and
15:19
I still go to one of the big hospitals here you see some of the corridors and it's like it feels very 18 1890s uh
15:28
style yeah how is the process for a foreigner like
15:34
to grow see the because your kids hasn't started school yet I suppose but my
15:40
daughter grows to kindergarten kindergarten it's a common thing here in gree to to do kindergarten I think like
15:48
I don't know if depends depends but since we have G now the second child
15:53
it's a little bit difficult I'm working in the home office um so I'm around with
15:59
my children every day it's a bit noisy my wife is alone with the other child
16:05
it's it's a little bit needy in this age um so it's difficult also for her to
16:11
spend her focus on both of the kids plus we have a small dog um so it's a little bit difficult so
16:18
we made the decision that okay my daughter goes now to kindergarten she's now two a bit more than 2 years old and
16:26
uh it's it's fine it's fine it's a a again the private thing like
16:32
unfortunately everything here in Greece or almost everything so we're also going to have to pay for this but it's all
16:39
right it's it's good we have a we have a daily routine which is which is nice is it difficult to find kindergarten I know
16:45
that in Germany for example it's a kind of difficult to find a spot it it's difficult to find a spot but at least
16:52
you know it's um public most of them uh
16:57
here if you try to get into the public kindergartens as As I understood my wife
17:02
has taken care of all of this stuff um so I'm not too deeply involved to this
17:08
but as I understood uh to get into public kindergartens at least the the decent
17:14
ones you have to know the mayor or no okay have contacts have contacts like
17:20
everything in gree you like everything in gree yes so yeah for us was no way that we
17:26
could go go somewhere in the public kindergarten so like most of the people we chose private one which which is also
17:34
nice it's a it's a nice kindergarten we're satisfied cool I think you said
17:39
something like your wife take carees of some things is due to language also because you said that you have Greek but
17:46
I know that You' been learning Greek but you're still learning still learning yes
17:51
okay how is the it's a typical topic from every expert in here coming and saying okay I'm learning Greek difficult
17:59
it it it's extremely difficult language and uh okay since Co came I stopped my
18:06
lessons and I'm just continue picking up phrases words and stuff like whenever I
18:13
can but it's not that I'm actively learning which is bad I'm I'm always
18:18
upset about myself because I would like to speak the language better and more um
18:24
but daily life grabs you and ESP especially with two children it doesn't
18:30
let you any space to to go also for some lessons or do even
18:36
other stuff like going to the gym or hanging out a lot with friends so kind
18:42
and the good thing about that the good and the bad thing is that you know here everything everybody speaks English yes
18:49
so if you have the basic Greek and
18:55
English you can survive here easily it's it's no no problem at all I don't know
19:01
if it's too good that all that's like a which which brings you to this it doesn't it doesn't force you to exactly
19:07
exactly that's what I mean it doesn't force you to to learn harder and you know like many people come here um and
19:14
they don't speak English so they're forced to to learn um I I know people
19:20
who live here for what one year and they speak fluently Greek which if you study
19:27
hard is not a problem yeah but for doing that you need to have the time like if you're working eight hours per
19:33
day you don't most of the people doesn't want to spend two hours more in the
19:39
afternoon every day to learn Greek if you do it and you spend like for I don't
19:45
know one year doing three times per week to two hours every day good you will
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speak Greek in one year perfectly no but of course the sacrifice that you're doing it's that you don't have any other
19:57
life than working and learning week exactly it's it's complex it's very
20:02
complex it is what is the thing that shock you most like because I'm always
20:07
curious with German it's a very different it's a very very different culture life I live four years in
20:14
Germany as you know like but when I came back here some things remind me of of a
20:21
Barcelona or of of Catalonia some years ago so I was used
20:26
to certain things still shock me some stuff but of course I suppose that if
20:31
you have a very strong German approach or Vision or I don't know if you had
20:37
that mentality but oh yeah I mean if you grow up in Germany there's no way
20:42
you break this this mentality what shocked me the most
20:52
um I wouldn't really say that something really really shocked me because as
20:58
before I said before I have been here many times I can't really I can't really
21:03
tell I mean traffic yeah it's crazy that's the
21:09
typical one yeah uh when I went the first day to to work I I had a small
21:15
smart and I was going from peris all the way down to glea and I arrived at the
21:21
office completely sweaty not because of the heat it was
21:26
warm as well but I was so stressed out I went up on the on the highway then the
21:32
whole traffic you know all the all the bikes going everybody speeding and I was
21:38
there like the sign said 50 I was going with
21:43
50 but nobody else was going so even trucks passed by and they honked at me
21:49
and I was like Jesus what's going on here until I after a few days I understood okay I I have to go with the
21:56
flow you need to adapt yeah but then when you understand how the the
22:01
traffic works it's fun I I prefer the traffic here a 100 times over the one in GRE in
22:09
in Germany I must say that for me for example
22:15
driving the motorbike city-wise it's a little bit more okay okay it's very
22:21
dangerous the car in the autoban I prefer it here than in Germany because
22:26
the autoban without limit me in Germany sometimes it's too crazy for me like the people
22:32
going way too fast I mean people here drives crazy but you are always like
22:37
knowing that everyone is driving crazy in Germany you are more or less relaxed because everyone follows the rules but
22:43
when there is no rule they put their cars at 280 and they pass you like flying and it's just like the [ __ ] is
22:50
going on so yeah in that sense absolutely more dangerous the traffic
22:55
here for sure statistically there is much more deaths here than in Germany oh is is that so yeah absolutely okay but
23:03
it's true that it's more once you get used to it it's more like yeah it's
23:10
because when you drive in Germany with a car you always check the speed limits you you watch okay 50 a sign for 50 and
23:17
you watch your car you you you watch that on my okay now I'm going 55 no I'm
23:23
going 60 okay I can't go much over 60 because if there's the chance that every
23:28
corner there's a speed camera a speed camera you know hiding in the bush so
23:33
you're very nervous not to exceed the speed limits too much
23:40
while here it's like yeah the Greeks see a police officer and they give more gas yeah the police officers don't do
23:46
anything either about it so how many people do you see without helmet and
23:52
once I was at the traffic light and I was in the morning on the way to work I was on the traffic light I had my phone
23:57
here you know I was older car had no speakers was just on the phone talking
24:02
and the next to me on the traffic lights stopped the police bike and uh you know
24:07
there was the guy was right next to me looking at me and I was there looking at him they didn't care why they wouldn't
24:15
stop me in Germany U you will be stopped for sure they they stopped me for no
24:21
reason the whole time I mean at least once per month you get stopped they see you they have stopped me several times
24:28
because they saw from miles away that I was on the phone or I was not wearing a
24:34
seat belt or just a just a general control for no
24:39
reason this is here there is speit cameras some of them none of them work
24:45
you never know when they are working I've seen it once that speed camer and synag in basilia Sophia yeah it's I saw
24:54
it open one or two times since I've been here it's crazy because of course nobody
25:00
counts that that camera ever Works they it's nonstop it's flash flash flash
25:06
flash flash flash flash flash and it's like wow okay nobody cares they don't
25:12
care it's it's it's a different mentality I think it just like it comes with okay we have other things to be
25:19
doing like taking care of this I don't know like yeah I I even saw the some months ago or maybe a year ago I saw a
25:26
statistic that in the center of Athens they're going to start they have put two years ago I think three years ago they
25:34
have they wanted to take care a little bit of the parking situation so they have hired a lot of um uh controls to to
25:42
give parking tickets yeah and I think I I can't remember exactly the the numbers
25:47
but I think it was like in in those few years they have given like
25:52
1 six million parking tickets and only two 100 thousands of them have been
26:00
actually paid everybody else like okay sure whatever I got once I paid it
26:06
yeah but what happened to me twice is that they took my license plates that's the other funny thing hearing this this
26:12
is weird I mean r to your car and you don't yeah I mean nobody really cares
26:18
about the parking situation I mean all over this country people Park wherever they want they don't care at all if they
26:25
block the you know no never block the containers never block the containers
26:31
that's the Only Rule because the track of the container will kick your car to take the containers out without any
26:38
problem yeah but anyway then for for parking where you're not supposed to park which is in Germany for example you
26:46
get a small ticket dep pends like1 15 or something they put it pay it Anda then they took your Li they take
26:53
away your license plates from the from the car and you have to go somewhere to theice office they they tell you like ah
27:00
you can just get it after one month and you're like hey I need my car I I cannot
27:06
wait for for one month what people are going crazy here in the traffic every day making whatever they want going over
27:13
the red lights all the time speeding all the time but then I parked wrong for
27:18
once and you take my license plates away and you keep it for for uh a whole
27:24
month where's the logic behind that well it's exactly what you said nobody pays
27:30
their bills so they take the plate so you need to go to the to the police yes or yes so you pay your thing yeah it's
27:36
their way of enforcing that you do your part yeah but then I was there the next day they took in one evening they took
27:43
my plates I went to the office the the next morning I had I I I paid the the
27:49
the bill and I said hey look can I have back my license plates no like no come back in 30 30 days
27:58
unless you know the mayor unless you have contacts and then the time it's normally reduced I mean I sented my wife
28:05
there she that's also a good solution yeah she she took care of it sending a
28:11
person who speaks Greek it's always a good solution yeah I think then we got it back after like 10 days they made the
28:16
exception for I can't remember the reason but uh yeah so typical it's so
28:24
Greek think things are funny here also with the police sometimes they're extremely strict but most of the times
28:31
they're like whatever what is your favorite part of living
28:36
here compared to Germany you will tell me the weather probably but well yeah I
28:43
mean the typical first of all it's the weather even though I have to admit that now after six years or six Summers spent
28:50
here I don't really like the summer so much anymore especially now with kids
28:55
because the first years when I was here I was at the beach every day I spent
29:00
time at the beach the moment I finished I used to working G I had in my car um I
29:07
had a small bag with my swim shorts with a towel and right after work 5:00 I was
29:14
at the beach 10 minutes after 5 I was laying at the beach Sun tunning swimming
29:20
um which was amazing um but now the last years no as more summer you go through
29:28
and also the weather gets even hotter Summer by summer I have the the impression
29:33
[Music] um I start to suffer like most of the Greeks do they they don't like summer so
29:41
much because you know it's long it's hot it's tiresome and also now in my situation
29:47
with two kids a dog I cannot go just whenever I want to the beach and say
29:53
okay guys I'm leaving the house bye and I go for for a swim chill
29:59
there at the beach drink myred espresso until it's uh night you know I I can't
30:04
do this anymore so when I'm lucky I can make it like once per week to the beach
30:11
but just when I'm lucky so actually I don't enjoy this this part so much
30:18
anymore um beside that of course the lifestyle you know Athens it's is so
30:24
Lively Greece in general um even the small villages you know you have a lot of people out in the in the
30:30
nights um which is in Germany not the case it's in Germany it's very much this
30:37
Monday to Thursday it's or Sunday to Thursday it's you stay at home go to bed
30:44
early have a you know your dinner home watch a movie go to bed here it's like
30:51
you're out every day it's I I can't remember any day that I stay at home
30:56
even even now with the kids we go out every day after I finish work we go
31:02
somewhere down in fos Marina for a walk or we go to G or n for a walk have a
31:09
coffee check B the shops um which is totally different from the from the
31:15
mentality in Germany and I really enjoy this I I don't like too much staying in the house even though I was used to it
31:22
and it was okay now thinking back
31:29
feeling a little bit like okay this was boring lifestyle you had so yeah this is this is a part I
31:37
enjoy a lot beside that everything else the
31:42
food the islands the in General Greece to to explore Greece as a as a whole
31:49
country before I used to travel a lot I try to I don't know be out of Germany
31:55
like at least five times per year m visiting Barcelona visiting Rome visiting wherever small small trips here
32:03
and there since I live here most of the time I spent
32:08
here going on the islands going in the mainland in the
32:13
mountains it's not so much that drives me out of the country
32:19
anymore so yeah this is what I enjoy as well nice favorite
32:25
island I have to say I I like the most the onion Islands okay
32:31
ke zakos those are I think those have been my best trips ni I like the most
32:38
this turqua Waters with this nice huge White Cliffs and some Greenery as well
32:47
um and the architecture there is nice as well I I don't like the klad so much
32:53
they're they have this nice typical Greek White House style
32:59
Villages um but the rest it's it's too dry it's very very Dead Island Rock yeah so
33:08
for me the E onion islands are are the best I would say cool so maybe now that
33:13
we are already in recommendations to close the first part a little bit I would like to ask you a little bit of
33:20
like what is your favorite kind of everything let's say like this you already touched food so do you have a
33:25
favorite dish Greek dish that's a very difficult one I I don't know how to respond to that one to be
33:32
honest I I expected this question and honestly I I don't really have a
33:39
favorite food I mean put me somewhere in a Taverna have some patas salad and the
33:46
plate with meat and I'm the happiest person all you know Mixed Plate with
33:52
some some Meats um soon it's uh Christmas time I excited that Mel marar
33:59
are coming back to to the stores very happy about that um sweets here yes
34:06
they're amazing I mean I I don't get the prices of the swits here how it's
34:11
possible like I don't know I know a couple of stores it's not that a single one I know that they do it like this
34:17
it's that know a couple of places that they do these individual cakes and they
34:22
put it in glass yeah and that cost like €2
34:28
in Germany in Germany that will cost the glass itself you know like yeah and you take here the glass and you take it like
34:35
I mean I don't know if there's people bringing it back don't think I don't think so like it's just
34:41
like I don't get how how is this like U business
34:47
working but me neither but I'm happy about it yeah yeah definitely definitely very good suits very good Su they're
34:53
extremely tasty as well I mean I don't know in Barcelona in Spain in general how the sweets are but you have lived in
34:59
Germany as well so sweets in Germany are not that sweet as they're here put sugar
35:06
in everything they you order a crepa and they they drown it in chocolate
35:13
sauce I mean it's crazy I I love chocolate I
35:18
love sweets so this is totally my country not the healthiest one probably
35:26
but no un not but I I enjoy it you know also in the evenings going out I don't
35:32
know in the center like ly sweet home or places like this just sit have a coffee
35:37
and have a whatever Bueno bump or it's after this you feel [ __ ] but it's it's
35:45
so good nice what about drinks any drink that you like from
35:53
Greece I mean which is which makes the most impression I mean because I'm not
35:58
drinking a lot of alcohol I mean sometimes when I go out of course but I'm not this kind of uzo or Masa or
36:06
whatever this this liquor stuff uh the beers are good I I like the drinks they
36:11
they're doing here they in general I think they serve very high quality drinks in all the bars here
36:19
um but the cold coffee Fredo espresso or Fredo capuccino is for me it's it's
36:27
unbeatable I mean Ive I've never found this anywhere else in in the world in in
36:33
this specific kind of way I mean you can go in Spain and tell them like I want a cold coffee but they they make it this
36:39
Starbuck kind of no we actually do in summer coffee with ice but it's
36:45
literally like they will bring you an espresso and they will bring you a glass with ice and then you Dro espresso
36:50
inside of the glass exactly exact it's not the whole Fred espresso thing of mixing it with the eyes already and with
36:57
sugar and whatever it's a complete different thing yeah it's it's different
37:02
and for me in in terms of drinks the the biggest impression is the the cold coffees like being in summer sitting
37:09
somewhere in the beach bar drinking your Fredo espresso and the nobody is hurrying you
37:17
up for finishing the coffee that's also ni yes of course of course so yeah for me this is
37:23
the the top the top yeah you said you like beer what is your favorite Greek
37:29
beer now we we will we will have a fight here yeah I think so because
37:39
I'm as a German I I should know a lot of good beer and I saw that you made even
37:44
recently some some recommendations about your favorite German beer um I like the
37:51
simple Alpha a lot okay because it's soft it's
37:57
very easy to drink especially for for summer I think it's a it's a very easy
38:03
beer just to have a good time with but but but tell me what's your
38:09
what's your I would I would always go for m m is m is also my top preference
38:15
always this would come the second this would come the second M berino NY now so there is a lot and the
38:25
quality it's very good I I mean I came from Germany of course the standards were there or
38:32
the there is bad beer in Germany also of course but there is a quantity of beers
38:38
that you can have everywhere that it's ridiculous here you have I don't know okay 10 commercial brands of beer and
38:45
then you will have start having I don't know nto blury or and these more like
38:51
more mcro Ries here and there in gree but um the level of amount of beer that
38:57
you have in Germany it's out of this world yeah it's dangerous
39:03
also but it it's good beer especially babaria area is yes they they're they
39:09
know how to do their things they know how to make beer that's right but yeah sometimes I think they're also too
39:15
strong I mean if you just want to sit and have a good time yeah definitely I mean that's I always say the same like
39:23
Guinness also it's a strong beer for example and you I mean actually Guinness it's for being a black beer it's
39:30
drinkable yeah it's dangerous but yeah BK beers in Germany or like trible or
39:36
like even they're hard some K beers you say okay you drink one and you're you're wasted like you're [ __ ] up okay as a
39:43
German I wouldn't say that but you know well not [ __ ] up but but you have
39:48
eaten like that that's food it's not drink it's like you're eating like
39:54
liquid true true what about culture things like do you listen to any Greek
40:01
music for example or do you follow any things
40:07
happening no unfortunately I have to pass on this um sometimes I go to buzia you know for
40:15
fun okay um I wish I could go more often my my wife hates it she's totally
40:21
against this stuff um but in general I don't listen too
40:27
much to to Greek music first because I can't really understand it and what I
40:32
understand is mostly it gives me hope to say nothing wrong here now sometimes a
40:38
bit ridiculous Vibes with this whole because whatever song it is it's about love it's about heartbreak and whole
40:47
drama yeah whole typical Greek drama stuff which I'm not so fond of so yeah when I
40:55
go out and there's a no good good song uh you know good Greek song I Like It U
41:01
I think the The Music In general the The rhythms and know stuff is nice but it's not that know like some other people you
41:09
know following the artist like Argos or those guys no any recommendation from
41:16
any for anyone who would come here to Athens in general like something that you would say okay I wish I would know
41:24
that when I arrive I mean in general from my experience
41:30
because before I made the step um I was very afraid of it I was thinking about it for for many years
41:37
um and as I explained before it happened very
41:43
spontaneously and uh it was hard at the beginning
41:50
so I I thought the first six months I thought so often about okay screw it I'm
41:56
going to quit this year I had now my my summer here it was like Autumn September
42:03
October I was like okay I'm done with this I'm done there are too many difficulties and I felt like okay I want
42:10
to go back I I just pack my stuff and I go [Music]
42:15
um so I think whenever you move abroad it brings a lot of
42:21
challenges um especially Athens you know when you start working here work life is here
42:27
depending on the company of course um can be a little bit challenging also the lifestyle here
42:35
sometimes you know people are a bit rude um traffic is crazy it's it's noisy here
42:42
um I think at the beginning depends where you come from depends on your expectations it can be a little bit
42:48
challenging everything of course you will enjoy all the good stuff know going to the beach going out and stuff like
42:53
this but um I think that it's can also very be very
42:58
challenging and my advice is go through it as long as you can try
43:06
to solve things out and uh I would say
43:12
that when you pass the difficulties and you got used to the life here you can have a very good life
The expert: Founding Picturo.eu
43:19
and the expert founding picture. so we already talk a little bit
43:27
about yourself and how you arrive here and your expert life now it would like to know what pictur is about and the
43:35
project that you have in your hands right now and you've built uh how difficult how if it was easy to build
43:42
something here or how how did you do uh but first question it's mandatory what
43:48
it's picture what do you do so pcto is all about photography um
43:55
we are a platform where tourists but locals as well um can
44:01
find very easily their photographer um according to their needs you know we
44:06
have built a platform where you can search per destination and find
44:11
available photographers in in your region that you want and uh yeah compare their Styles
44:19
compare their prices get in touch with them either book them directly through Piko
44:24
or um get in touch with them see their social media see some images the way
44:31
they they shoot so yeah we have created pcto to give people the easiest way to
44:37
find a decent photographer without any effort okay cool is like the main goal
44:44
behind it nice and it's basically a website platform
44:49
or um it's kind of web application right now it's just a platform uh just a web
44:57
it but it can also be used as a app we're not on the App Store live right
45:03
now but this is one of the next steps we're going to do we have so many projects ahead that you know we want
45:11
to uh update on on Piko and uh this is of course one of them to have our app in
45:17
the app store also expand on other countries right now we're just available in Greece mhm um at least just Greek
45:25
photographers uh here and um yeah we want to expand all over Europe um with
45:32
the app then and this is the goal nice how do you find the photographers as a
45:38
company I mean like um usually the photographers find us okay I mean of
45:44
course we make a a little bit of ads but they're not targeting specifically the
45:50
photographers um usually it targets everyone who likes
45:55
photography so they find us and they they register on our platform it's
46:01
sometimes if we see a very nice photographer on on some destination we
46:06
targeting them and we send them a message like hey we like your style of Photography would you like to
46:14
join um but usually photographers find us in the register so it's not a process
46:20
that we uh hire somebody or we know invite somebody very actively to to join
46:26
join pcto it's more like whenever there's a good photographer who wants to
46:31
join our platform to have a profile um have a booking system know they they can do
46:40
it they can just register um we double check their data if you know it's a legit and uh you know it fits to our
46:47
Styles and then yeah photographers can
46:52
join our team there were two photographers interviewed in the podcast previously before this episode so one of
47:00
them uh yeah I actually found you through okay okay um was Natalia yeah
47:06
Natalia yes she's she's also pcto photographer okay you didn't know she's
47:12
very good she actually did a photo shooting with me and and Katherine just
47:17
after the recording she was looking for some couple to do a photo shooting and
47:23
it happened so actually I interviewed her and then after one week I was doing photo shooting with her so she's very
47:28
good so anyone who's looking big recommendation I will send
47:34
you the the profile of the second one okay or the other way
47:39
around where does this come from like are you a photographer yourself how how this whole project starts why do you
47:45
decide to build this um basically it's because I'm not a photographer uh but I like
47:51
photography um as I said before I used to travel a lot I like traveling um
47:58
and for me I have to admit that especially the times of Instagram
48:06
have influenced me a little bit also where to travel and you know gave me
48:11
impression of you know you see some travel influencers and they go to to Barcelona or to whatever place and they
48:19
have these amazing photos and you're you're sitting at home at your couch and you're like oh okay this is a nice place
48:25
I want to go there as well so you get influenced in the first place by good
48:30
photographer at least it happened to me that I wanted to go to this place because I saw an amazing picture of
48:39
it but me as as I said I'm not a photographer myself um so what happened to me is that
48:46
sometimes I I traveled to these places I remembered some photos I I saw from
48:51
specific places uh you know and I wanted to recreate Rec cre them and you know
48:58
with a phone camera you you just can't do it's it's it's impossible
49:05
and it happened sometimes that I I flew back home after after trip and know
49:12
while the trip you do like endless photos with your phone and I even sometimes I got a camera you know good
49:19
equipment but still never I could do what photographers do um and then
49:27
sometimes after the trip even though we we spent a lot of effort on making good photos and okay here and there some good
49:34
photos happened like accidentally I would say um I was sometimes disappointed that okay um the photos are
49:43
not the same it's not what I saw at the internet so you had some expectations
49:49
and then you yeah I had some expectations on myself that I couldn't fulfill and um I had either the choice
49:56
of going to course for photography or creating pictur and I
50:02
chose the second the little bit more difficult part but more exciting part yes so you are one of the creators and
50:10
founders of of picture itself is there more people involved or it's a solo
50:16
project no no there I'm not a programmer or anything else that there's a whole team behind it I'm I actually had the
50:23
idea of this whole application I have to admit the the basic idea was my wife's
50:31
at one point she said like ah because she also likes photos she also you is a
50:37
mini influencer and uh whenever we travel together we try to make the best
50:42
out of you know what we were able to do and um you know sometimes you search for
50:50
photographers online and you either go this way of searching on on Instagram
50:57
you know for Photograph you can find but then it's always the struggle hey like your profile like your photos we're
51:04
coming and then are you available what's the price it's a little bit difficult
51:09
difficult to arrange or you go through Google you find many photographers websites some of
51:17
them you you still have to get in contact with them in some ways um discuss some
51:24
stuff ask for the availabilities many of them they don't have prices
51:29
online so you have to request a price or you have to fill out a form um and we said we want to create
51:37
something as simple as possible so that you go on pcto you want a photo shooting
51:43
you go on our website you have in your region 10 15 20 photographers available
51:49
you can with one click switch their profiles see all the necessary data you want get in touch with the way you want
51:57
so make it the easiest um way possible this was actually the the or
52:04
this is actually the whole idea of Piko to create something mainly for The
52:10
Travelers that go wherever like we have photographers in sorini in Athens and
52:16
Thessaloniki and mikonos and many many destinations all over the country so
52:22
wherever the tourists go they can find very easily a bunch of photographers that they can um choose from and uh yeah
52:33
that's that's our goal that's the vision that's somehow uh based on our our
52:40
private life how this idea came up and back to your question there's a whole team behind pikus just not me I I had
52:47
the idea my wife had the idea I made it a real thing um but yeah we're working
52:55
as a whole team behind it do you do pets photos
53:00
also there is animal photographers there yes they I think in Athens we have one
53:07
guy his name is Elias um he's a specific dog photographer oh really okay yeah he
53:13
he's very good they didn't know that that existed as a concept yes cool um at first when he registered
53:20
and I saw his profile I was not sure okay does this fit to our what we want
53:26
on our website but okay I like pets I like dogs so why not why why
53:32
not what's the process of a photographer to come in so you said that you check
53:38
their profiles but basically they register it's a kind of community approach so you don't just come to
53:44
pictur you just uh go to the website and fill in an application form or kind of
53:51
like this yeah I mean as well for for all the involved parties for the photo
53:56
photographers and for the let's say customers The Travelers or even the
54:01
locals it's it's it's for everyone we want to keep things as easy as possible because nobody likes complicated yeah I
54:08
mean there are some other websites out there which offer kind of the same
54:15
service but it's either involved with some extra cost like you have to book a
54:21
package with someone you cannot choose a photographer you just have to book like
54:27
Athens photo walk okay for I don't know a specific amount and you don't even know who's going to come there as a as a
54:35
photographer um so or there are other sides you have to send a requests and
54:42
you know it it's a bit struggle for us it was always the goal that okay a photographer wants to join okay join we
54:50
going to make a quick check if the photographer is no scammer um if he's has the the
54:57
right qualities to to be a professional and if he's no scammer when he's passed
55:03
the check we make him we put him online and all good it's if you want to
55:08
register it's a matter of five to 10 minutes and you're you're online you have your whole profile you have your
55:14
booking system for photographers is very easy and again also for the end users we
55:21
try to keep it as simple as possible because no especially in Holiday nobody lik
55:29
lose to requests and you know emails and it's nice it's timec consuming I also
55:37
wanted to ask you it's how difficult was it to build picture of being here you
55:43
build it directly from Greece like uh how what's the challenges that you
55:50
find the building and doing the ENT entrepre entrepreneur approach no into
55:56
into whole thing um well the the company is Germany
56:02
based um it was very difficult uh as well to make the split because you have
56:10
to make a lot of paperworks in Germany I mean in general I'm going a lot back and forth because I have another job which
56:16
is located there then I'm coming here so go back and forth the whole time um but still it
56:25
was very time consuming also make the whole paperworks in Germany then come back here be with the family then go
56:31
back because you had to another appointment fill out some other paperworks it's it was very difficult
56:38
um but we decided as a whole team to start on the Greek market
56:44
um because I knew some photographers here have done in the past some some photo shoots here uh which also gave me
56:51
a little bit the idea of creating something like this because in Germany when you want to make a photo
56:58
shooting and you go to a photographer they take you like starting I don't know from 150 and
57:06
up they they don't even get out of bed for Less
57:12
usually when I started here it was 2018 19 was then I I made my first few photo
57:19
shoots and just for fun was bored I had no no real friends or anything I went to some photo shootings um
57:27
I had photo shootings for like 30 40 and I was like okay this is
57:33
ridiculous and also the the idea behind it was that if people in Germany would
57:40
know as an example that when they come here they can make a photo shooting for
57:47
40 they they would go much more for it I
57:52
mean I I don't want to I think for EUR is even it's too cheap but the competition is
57:59
very big so many photographers go that low um which is I would say a little bit
58:04
sad thing but for the end user for the one who wants to have a photo shooting
58:10
it's a nice thing and uh I I think what that people who are coming here I don't know from the States from northern
58:17
Europe or wherever I mean where can you find photo shootings for these prices so
58:22
it made it easier to take the decision of focalizing first on the Greek market to then expand start from here to start
58:30
growing yes I mean I had also my concerns based on mentality a little bit
58:36
uh I think Greeks are not so open for new things I I would say um they they
58:44
really like to stick in the most cases to their ways of doing it to to what
58:50
they know when you try to enter with something new in the market I think it's
58:56
quite challenging here in Greece luckily there are a lot of foreigners photographers um so I would say maybe
59:04
half of the photographers that are on P right now are foreigners
59:11
um which helps a lot of they're also Greeks a lot of Greeks registered so it
59:17
was my biggest fear actually that you know the Greeks would maybe not enter enter they would say like okay what is
59:24
this I don't know this I don't want this is um but luckily
59:30
uh they we have gained some some trust and also many Greek photographs have
59:35
joined us nice this was my biggest fear and in terms of struggle typical
59:42
entrepreneurship I mean building a company is always comp complex no exactly exactly what about the audience
59:49
like do you have the data of how many people are Greeks versus uh Travelers or
59:55
people who are coming on because of our booking through picture um this I can
1:00:03
not track directly I mean I can see from where people join it is the majority is
1:00:09
here in Greece um know if they are tracking registering from here being I
1:00:16
someone from Italy exactly I can I cannot track this and I think I don't even know this is legal um but anyway
1:00:24
this is language you could track it's the only thing language I could track yeah but in general we just track from
1:00:31
which part like Athens or Thessalon or you know we we track we we are able to
1:00:38
track from which city somebody or from which country somebody goes on our website um which is mainly in gree
1:00:46
because also our ads mainly are on on meta are are locally
1:00:53
placed um because we also have a lot of wedding photog rers baptisms and stuff
1:00:58
which is here huge Market um and most of the photographers especially the Greek
1:01:03
ones they're focused on weddings and uh stuff like this so we place a lot of ads
1:01:09
for them here in in Greece but from from many other
1:01:15
countries as well we have a lot of searches from the states uh who who check your photographer
1:01:21
and everywhere from everywhere they they find us what is the business model
1:01:26
behind it how do you earn money out of it or it's like you take a commission
1:01:33
out of every booking or um no um this
1:01:38
was a big factor for us as well because usually how other websites in in this
1:01:44
way operate is that they take a commission like usually 20
1:01:50
30% um fee yeah so which
1:01:57
we believe is steal stealing of U money um from the photographers and on the
1:02:04
other hand then the photographer they put this extra money because they say Okay I want to have1 EUR for my photo
1:02:10
shooting if I don't know another website takes me 30% I charge the 30% on top so
1:02:17
that at the end I get my1 so which makes the photos shoot also for the End
1:02:22
customer at the end of the day more expensive um we have decided
1:02:28
that at least in our minds and as we understood also the
1:02:35
photographers agree that we have a yearly subscription when you're a photographer you want to register on
1:02:42
piuro um recently we have uh started to add a fee booking subscription of uh
1:02:52
now it's €45 for one whole year okay which is in in our main in our mind it's a
1:03:00
quite small amount um and yeah once you pay this fee or online you have the
1:03:06
whole year to so basically is a subscription model yeah okay it makes sense because then you are not
1:03:12
compromising no the the fact of like raising prices because everyone raises their prices because you're taking out
1:03:18
of each booking something no like exactly and it's again in our mind
1:03:24
because we want to keep things also here as simple as possible we don't
1:03:29
want to steal from everybody anybody money we say okay if you have 100
1:03:35
bookings per year through piuro Fine By Us they're all 100% yours you don't have
1:03:42
to charge extra fee to the customer we don't take any money from you you have
1:03:47
your small subscription which is quite small I would say um 45 per
1:03:54
year it's small there is there is much bigger subscriptions than exactly
1:03:59
exactly um I mean we also have our cost of having the the whole website running I mean we're not getting uh right now
1:04:06
millionaires Filthy Rich with this 45 um but yeah we we consider it as very
1:04:14
fair and uh yeah this is the the model we work so also like this we we give the
1:04:20
opportunity for um the customer we don't
1:04:25
say okay you have to book or leave if you go on the profile of the
1:04:31
photographer you have several options what you can do you can book but you can also get them you know contact them you
1:04:37
can call them you can email them you can WhatsApp them um you can switch to their
1:04:43
social media profiles you have all the options so we don't force end customers
1:04:49
to click to commit a booking mhm so we we give them the chance like okay do you
1:04:55
want to talk to the photographer first get in touch in whatever your way you want so we we are not um controlling the
1:05:04
whole yeah we're not relying on okay press the booking button so we get our
1:05:09
commission of yeah whatever 50 so yeah this is the business model
1:05:18
behind that no no it makes a lot of sense you already talk about the mobile app as the next step is there any other
1:05:27
future soon future plans that you can talk about it for for
1:05:32
picture um or is right now the big focus is the getting the mobile done no it's
1:05:37
not so much getting the the mobile app done um I think the mobile the
1:05:43
application is most interesting for the photographers themselves because we have
1:05:50
behind pcto that behind every photographer's profile is a whole booking system they can U you know
1:05:57
manage their calendars can check their bookings you know when when there's a booking request they have to accept it
1:06:03
to the whole administrative part of it yeah so I think for especially for photographers themselves um the
1:06:11
application will be a good step but this is right now not our Focus we
1:06:18
want to expand because we're right now just in Greece um which is a quite small
1:06:24
Market at least in terms of photographers um Greece okay has a lot
1:06:29
of tourists um but has a very few destinations with limited quantity of
1:06:37
photographers we want to be at some point all over all over Europe so by
1:06:43
next year we're going to be available in Spain Italy Germany France hopefully W
1:06:50
okay so this is this is our main focus to expand in other countries
1:06:55
get awareness by the photographers and the the people who like photography um to also reach more
1:07:03
audience in in general because right now it's it's very grease
1:07:09
focused um but yeah we we want to expand that this is the this is the biggest
1:07:14
step this is the biggest challenge um because as we said before when the
1:07:21
camera was off getting you know nowadays reaching more and more people gets more
1:07:28
and more difficult because this the way it is right now you have competence and at the same time you
1:07:34
have so many I don't know things going on social media being the one who pops
1:07:40
up in there it's difficult being the one who puts your content in there Pro promoting yourself it's difficult and
1:07:47
exactly yeah well it's what it is nowadays you need to put a lot of hours
1:07:53
on content creation and that it's not the focus of your work directly no yeah
1:07:59
I mean we have a social media manager we have a somebody who runs our ads properly we we have in our team know the
1:08:07
the right people to do it but again it's a it's a tough long road that uh you
1:08:15
know we have to go and uh brings a lot of challenges and unfortunately it's
1:08:20
also very costly um but yeah I I hope that the end
1:08:25
of the day um we're going to have good results well
1:08:31
I hope people who are listeners are I mean now most of the people who listens
1:08:37
are in gree so at least they already have available if you're listening from one of the countries that uh J Jan just
1:08:44
said like it's a matter of time that it arrives to your home so it's um just check it out so follow us on Instagram
1:08:52
and whenever you need a photographer in Greece check
1:08:58
P.E and uh surely you will find somebody who fits to your needs and uh price
1:09:04
range yeah perfect I was going to ask as the last mandatory question where the
Outro
1:09:10
people can find it but you already solve that so basically follow pictor check the website pct. as always this will be
1:09:17
in the links are always in the description of the of the interview perfect thanks a lot uh for your time
1:09:24
today and for coming and explaining everything uh it has been a pleasure talking with you same was very nice to
1:09:30
be here share a bit my view of being an expert uh I think everybody has very
1:09:37
different views very different um experiences so I think it's nice to hear
1:09:44
from a lot of different people a lot of different opinions so thanks for having me here and let me share mine and uh
1:09:51
yeah it was very nice thanks a lot thanks